Please explain

A please explain needed from the VAL. My understanding is events this season should have equal prize money for men and women. Seems for the most part clubs have honoured equal prize money and enforced this new rule, which is great.

I noticed entries are open now for the Castlemaine Gift, which has a 400 metre Open for $2500 and a 400 metre Women’s for $4000. Why is this? Massive difference coin wise.

I’m hoping it’s a typo and is fixed asap to avoid any confusion. And if not a typo, an explanation why would be great.

Speedy…whilst I know you’re just being antagonistic, I’ll respond anyway.

I believe it has been legislated that the Men’s and Women’s GIFTS have to be equal prize money. Which they are. Which in some cases has actually been harder to find money for the men’s gift having spoken to a couple of clubs.

The women’s 400 at Castlemaine has always had more than the open (not men’s fyi).

One thing I will say, is there should be a small amount of flexibility with the equal prize money if it all works out in the end. For example: Keilor had more money available for the Men’s gift but had to lower it to make it level. Castlemaine had more money available for the women’s gift but had to lower it to make it level. Why didn’t we just get the 2 clubs together and have more money for the Men at Keilor, and more money for the Women at Castlemaine. If that makes any sense? More money overall for the same split long term.

Thanks Tim for the clarification,

Disagree with you on the antagonistic part, I’m mostly curious to be honest as the VAL have pushed and pushed equal prize money/equality greatly in recent times. I genuinely hope it’s a typo and it’s fixed up for the sake of equality in the league. Would be disappointing for the VAL if not fixed.

I’m aware the Castlemaine womens 400 has always been more then the open, however the Keilor 400 open/mens has always been greater then the women’s, yet this was changed this year to equal prize money. Castlemaine should be the same.

I too would like to see some flexibility as you mentioned and your point makes some sense. Geelong had a 300 women’s but not a 300 men’s, that’s fine I suppose. So there already does seem to be some flexibility. However a $1500 difference is a slap in the face and a major disadvantage to male athletes who train and compete just as hard as female athletes. They both deserve to be competing for the same overall, I think we both agree on that.

Speedy wrote:Thanks Tim for the clarification,

Disagree with you on the antagonistic part, I’m mostly curious to be honest as the VAL have pushed and pushed equal prize money/equality greatly in recent times. I genuinely hope it’s a typo and it’s fixed up for the sake of equality in the league. Would be disappointing for the VAL if not fixed.

I’m aware the Castlemaine womens 400 has always been more then the open, however the Keilor 400 open/mens has always been greater then the women’s, yet this was changed this year to equal prize money. Castlemaine should be the same.

I too would like to see some flexibility as you mentioned and your point makes some sense. Geelong had a 300 women’s but not a 300 men’s, that’s fine I suppose. So there already does seem to be some flexibility. However a $1500 difference is a slap in the face and a major disadvantage to male athletes who train and compete just as hard as female athletes. They both deserve to be competing for the same overall, I think we both agree on that.

Hi Speedy
Let me explain
While Tim seems to love his 2 cents his not always correct.
The problem now is the league has gone woke.
It’s clear as day.
You have certain people in there that are racing claiming for equal rights. They are wanting equal prize money and equal everything yet female numbers are clearly showing that they are always 1/3 to half the mens numbers.
Im not against women having the same money but you must at least be 85% or closer to the mens numbers.
Maryborough was a cesspool and a joke.
Less then 20 people showed up and they made 3 heats or 4 if I remember to make it look good yet the men had more then double.

They then go and make some write up at Warnambool about the women having more entries then the men.
The reason was because the men couldn’t be bothered driving and that was the result.
Week in week our men continue to out perform women in attendance but if it continues we will see a decline in men turning up to race for was Ballarat was once a 8k 120m gift and had to “split” because of equal rights garbage and same with 25 entries for a 15K gift at Maryborough.

Hi Woodchopper, I think you’ve kind of helped explain it. But surely the reason for low entries at Warrnambool isn’t because they couldn’t be bothered driving

I guess my main reason for this post is to spread some awareness of this major inequality and ask the question why. As I said earlier, I’m guessing it’s a typo but the question still needs to be asked.

Just imagine if the shoe was on the other foot, and at Castlemaine there was a 400 mens for $4000 and a 400 open for $2500. I can assure you there would be certain people speaking up and causing a rouse, and a protest of some sort would happen, remember Keilor last year? I wonder if those same people will speak up here and protest if it’s not a typo. I also don’t think the VAL would ever allow a 400 men’s and 400 open to happen, so how come they’re allowing it here?

Anyways, let’s hope it’s a typo, gets fixed up and we can all move on.

So I’m wrong because I didn’t answer “because the league has gone woke”.

Firstly, I just answered with facts. The suggestion at the end was a way to increase prize money under the current arrangement. Hardly controversial I would’ve thought.

Saying the “league has gone woke” is just a lazy way of not coming up with a real argument. It makes everything you say from then on lose credibility. Just respond with facts, figures, opinions and ideas. Not overused buzz words. Everyone knows what happened at Maryborough was not great. But do you think that means a long term plan should just be thrown away? Or should we find ways to fix/improve it?

Speedy wrote:Hi Woodchopper, I think you’ve kind of helped explain it. But surely the reason for low entries at Warrnambool isn’t because they couldn’t be bothered driving

I guess my main reason for this post is to spread some awareness of this major inequality and ask the question why. As I said earlier, I’m guessing it’s a typo but the question still needs to be asked.

Just imagine if the shoe was on the other foot, and at Castlemaine there was a 400 mens for $4000 and a 400 open for $2500. I can assure you there would be certain people speaking up and causing a rouse, and a protest of some sort would happen, remember Keilor last year? I wonder if those same people will speak up here and protest if it’s not a typo. I also don’t think the VAL would ever allow a 400 men’s and 400 open to happen, so how come they’re allowing it here?

Anyways, let’s hope it’s a typo, gets fixed up and we can all move on.

Take a look at entries.
Warrnambool 52 for men
Waverley had nearly double.
Maryborough had low entries but that’s standard.


Again, take a look on Facebook.
There is a particular female screaming and made a big deal about Keillor last year saying she wasn’t going because the mens prize pool was bigger then womens.
Plus her comments when the Val put up nominations on FB.

Men want equality to.
Match the numbers and happy to see it.
Women are getting low entries and wanting the same money.

Speedy wrote:Hi Woodchopper, I think you’ve kind of helped explain it. But surely the reason for low entries at Warrnambool isn’t because they couldn’t be bothered driving

I guess my main reason for this post is to spread some awareness of this major inequality and ask the question why. As I said earlier, I’m guessing it’s a typo but the question still needs to be asked.

Just imagine if the shoe was on the other foot, and at Castlemaine there was a 400 mens for $4000 and a 400 open for $2500. I can assure you there would be certain people speaking up and causing a rouse, and a protest of some sort would happen, remember Keilor last year? I wonder if those same people will speak up here and protest if it’s not a typo. I also don’t think the VAL would ever allow a 400 men’s and 400 open to happen, so how come they’re allowing it here?

Anyways, let’s hope it’s a typo, gets fixed up and we can all move on.

In reference to the Castlemaine 400 women’s v opens.  Let’s be frank and factual. We know the open is the men’s 400m. Its no typographical error.  Of course its unfair and contrary to the regulations. It’s not really about gender equity and parity but rather self interest. Equity across events has not increased relative to the rate of change for one gender and at sprint distances. Numbers week to week in distance events are low, prizemoney in sprint events v distance have not been equitable. It's a separate argument but just show's how equity is not the goal.

You will still have those that will defend the system, but they have shared morals and values on this issue. In their minds they can do no wrong.

Spot on FF.

Almost a day later and still no update or change. I’m starting to think it’s not a typo. Disappointing for the VAL to let this happen given their push for 'parity’ in recent years, majority of meetings have come on board for ‘parity’ but this is the biggest discrepancy by far.

Also if we know the open is the mens 400, then why not make it a mens 400? Even if it’s for $1500 less prize money. Poor form across the board. I’m nervous to see what the repercussions will be once more athletes find out. Based off my conversations today there are numerous male and female athletes who aren't happy.

Speedy wrote:Spot on FF.

Almost a day later and still no update or change. I’m starting to think it’s not a typo. Disappointing for the VAL to let this happen given their push for 'parity’ in recent years, majority of meetings have come on board for ‘parity’ but this is the biggest discrepancy by far.

Also if we know the open is the mens 400, then why not make it a mens 400? Even if it’s for $1500 less prize money. Poor form across the board. I’m nervous to see what the repercussions will be once more athletes find out. Based off my conversations today there are numerous male and female athletes who aren't happy.

Numerous athletes won’t be happy until all athletes stand for fairness.
It’s easy for most who the prize pool suits but not as a whole.
It will continue to happen

It doesn’t take too much common sense to see why the event remains as open 400m.  Some facts from other sports which may help everyone navigate forward.

The men’s soccer World Cup generates $6 billion in revenue, in comparison the Women’s World Cup generates $131 million in revenue. The flow on effect that males earn substantially more. Statistically and mathematically the pay / prizemoney differences are purely based on how much revenue the sport brings in.

The average WNBA player earns around $100,000. Compared to the average salary of $7 million in the NBA.  Again, the revenue is based on how much revenue the NBA brings in compared to women’s. The men’s league brings in approx. 8 billion whilst the women’s has run at loss for most of its history.

Now the argument is that TV rights, sponsorship and opportunities limit the growth and revenue of female sports. In the case of the WNBA, which has been around since 1997. The market has spoken, TV stations promote what brings in viewers and in the case of the WNBA the market does not find the game entertaining.

Women’s AFL and other codes have 10-year development plans, but if you look at the WNBA. The reality is that the market does prefer to watch the men’s game in that context. These are the facts regarding market demands.
The fact is the sport will become less attractive to male competitors. This won’t just be male competitors but also, sponsors, clubs and volunteers that don’t comply with the agenda imposed on them. Unless prizemoney is based on how much revenue (entries) or proportional to sponsorship then situations like Maryborough will arise again.  Last year the fiasco at Keilor was in plain sight for everyone to see. Moving forward this year there was more sponsorship money for the men’s race at Keilor and I can only imagine the pressure applied for the club to conform. As pointed out the ‘open 400” at Castlemaine just points out the double standards being applied.

There is a need to come up with fairer system and not have a minority that are self-assured of their own virtue / moral superiority force their preferred ways onto everyone else.

Factual Feminist wrote:It doesn’t take too much common sense to see why the event remains as open 400m.  Some facts from other sports which may help everyone navigate forward.

The men’s soccer World Cup generates $6 billion in revenue, in comparison the Women’s World Cup generates $131 million in revenue. The flow on effect that males earn substantially more. Statistically and mathematically the pay / prizemoney differences are purely based on how much revenue the sport brings in.

The average WNBA player earns around $100,000. Compared to the average salary of $7 million in the NBA.  Again, the revenue is based on how much revenue the NBA brings in compared to women’s. The men’s league brings in approx. 8 billion whilst the women’s has run at loss for most of its history.

Now the argument is that TV rights, sponsorship and opportunities limit the growth and revenue of female sports. In the case of the WNBA, which has been around since 1997. The market has spoken, TV stations promote what brings in viewers and in the case of the WNBA the market does not find the game entertaining.

Women’s AFL and other codes have 10-year development plans, but if you look at the WNBA. The reality is that the market does prefer to watch the men’s game in that context. These are the facts regarding market demands.
The fact is the sport will become less attractive to male competitors. This won’t just be male competitors but also, sponsors, clubs and volunteers that don’t comply with the agenda imposed on them. Unless prizemoney is based on how much revenue (entries) or proportional to sponsorship then situations like Maryborough will arise again.  Last year the fiasco at Keilor was in plain sight for everyone to see. Moving forward this year there was more sponsorship money for the men’s race at Keilor and I can only imagine the pressure applied for the club to conform. As pointed out the ‘open 400” at Castlemaine just points out the double standards being applied.

There is a need to come up with fairer system and not have a minority that are self-assured of their own virtue / moral superiority force their preferred ways onto everyone else.

You could argue all that but then
No one really cares?

The women want more money for less views, less interest , less effort.

Take for instance.
The mens Stawell gift.
It had and will always be the highlight of Stawell gift.
Not saying anything wrong against the women but it’s a “add on” really.
All this woke crap about equal rights and fair pay.
How hard was it for the men back in the 90s at Stawell.
They had to win their heats to progress with so many entrants.

My point is what has a strong foundation should be the focus. The women can build their foundation the same way men did by generating numbers and performance. Not complaining on Facebook