Something to cheer about

Well done to the SAAL committee, some common sense has prevailed in sorting out the past 3 years of handicapping mess. I guess the question remains who will the handicappers be?

It takes some courage to acknowledge what hasnt worked and sort it out.

MESSAGE TO ATHLETES, COACHES, OFFICIALS AND SUPPORTERS
As promised at the AGM and in subsequent correspondence via team app and social media
an organisational review was completed by August 30th. Recommendations have now been
assessed by the Management Committee and decisions made regarding the 2022/23
season.
This review was undertaken at no cost to the League by a professional consulting firm with
relevant experience and expertise, MF Brown and Associates. The review covered many
areas of our sport such as the use of data in handicapping and the handicapping system in
the context of the sporting culture that is Professional Handicap Running.
The League is indebted to Mark Brown for his outstanding work.
Thank you to everyone who took the time to complete the survey, and to those who
contacted us with your thoughts or concerns. We greatly appreciate your contribution.
The report amalgamated the thoughts and aspirations of the South Australian Athletic
League (SAAL) including Life Members, Coaches, Officials and Athletes, via an on-line
survey.
As a committee the review provided us with an in-depth summary of these views. They were
consistent and overwhelming. As such the committee has prioritised them for prompt action.
Key to the review was that the SAAL community expressed a consistent view in terms of
what we are looking for in an athlete who competes in the South Australian Athletic League:
It found that Athletes, Coaches and Supporters:
 Want to know that the athlete who wins the event is deserving of the sash, the prize
money, and the accolades.
 The winning of the Open event is to be the pinnacle of the sport, with the jewels in the
crown Open feature events at Category 1 and 2 carnivals.
 Want to reward Athletes who compete frequently at SAAL events or are in the process of
building a career in the SAAL.
 Want athletes who travel to support regional SAAL events.
 Want athletes to show continuous improvement, progressing from participating in heats
to winning heats, participating in semi-finals, and then winning semi-finals, participating
in finals, and then winning a final.
 Believe that subject to the number of events entered in a season, the progression to a
sash should take greater than 1 season and less than 3 seasons i.e., in your second
season of competition in the SAAL you are close to winning your first sash.
The Committee wants to ensure that the sport of professional handicap athletics provides a
motivating, healthy environment where all athletes can compete vigorously. Our committee
will ensure that our sport retains its integrity and governance through a combination of good
data processes and increased human involvement.

THE HANDICAPPING SYSTEM
The current handicapping system uses a combination of data from previous runs to provide
a metre per second rate that can be used to determine a handicap based on a league
allocated target time.
This is essentially the process that has been used for many years. This data, including a
system derived handicap projection, is provided to the handicapper who determines a mark
for each athlete with SAAL Guidelines.
Currently races are stewarded at category 1 and 2 only. All other races rely chiefly on
system derived data as a stewarding tool. I.e. Z scores.
The motivation behind elements of the current system was that it could ultimately take the
human element out of the handicapping process and provide handicaps and stewarding with
little intervention.
The system is NOT there yet. The decisions outlined below are the Leagues response to
your feedback.
League decision In response to:
We will continue to use a data-based
system in collecting and projecting data for
handicap and stewarding purposes.
The system will be changed to include your
feedback on the following:
 The use of Novice marks
 Application of penalties
 Lift rates
 Stewarding
 Qualifications for cat 1 and 2 events
 Spread of the field
 Z scores.
Good data is an essential element of a
handicapper’s decision-making process.
The system provides this.
The key element of the system, the metres
per second (mps), is working and should be
retained
Handicappers being the key element in the
handicapping process, using the data and
the League guidelines for handicapping as
a guide.
The reality is that a non-human based
system is an ideal and the committee
believes human interaction with the system
is paramount.
All models are subject to gaming of the
system by Athletes and Coaches and the
current model is no exception to this.
Handicap increases toward target times will
be carefully and equitably applied for all
Athletes through the use of a standard
lifting table
A standard lift chart will provide a common
reference point to be used by the
handicapper in association with the data.
Deviation from this standard approach may
only be made via submission to the
handicap committee where the handicapper
is of the view that lifts will not take the
Athlete to a winning position over a two
year time-frame.
An overwhelming view that athletes new to
the sport are provided with lifts that are too
generous and lifts were inconsistent and
applied inequitably.
League decision In response to:
Handicap regression (Pulls) will not apply to
athletes who have not won money by
winning or placing in an event except where
that reduction is the result of a stewarding
intervention.
The negativity de-motivation and confusion
surrounding Athletes who did not win, place
or win money and who were being
penalised is against human motivations and
the spirit and culture of Professional
Athletics.
That the League will provide race stewards
for ALL race meetings and adopt
face to face stewarding.
A culture of engagement with coaches and
runners prior and post races will be
cultivated
There was an overwhelming view that
stewarding over recent seasons was not
working and did not pick up many obvious
breaches of the rules at smaller meets.
Stewards needs to be proactive and
engage with Athletes before and after races
to identify or work through performance
issues.
Members felt that there was too much
reliance on the z score aspect of the
system and not enough face to face
assessment.
An athlete’s personal best time from the
previous 2 years to be presented to
the handicapper and stewards for
consideration in handicap allocation and
stewarding.
The view that Athletes can manipulate their
mps time such that the handicapper does
not consider their fastest mps rate when
determining a final allocated handicap.
The provision of the fastest mps will provide
another view for the handicapper to assess
when making a handicap allocation.
That wind ratings will be modified to remove
wind readings greater than + and - 3 mps
as a basis for data in the system.
Wind levels were regarded as subjective at
higher levels and particularly unreliable at
higher wind rates where there are greater
wind fluctuations.
Performances at + or – 3 mps will still be
subject to stewards’ assessment and would
count as qualifying races for category 1 and
2 events.
That the field should be brought back in all
races such that we are presenting the
spectators with backmarkers
This be implemented after we work with
system developers to assess our ability to
do this and also accommodate elite back
markers when they compete.
It was considered the fields have been so
spread out that many runners are too far off
completing the full race distance.
The optics of spread fields are poor
All Novice runners, irrespective of previous
competition in unaffiliated Leagues, will be
allocated a Novice mark at best as a
starting point for their SAAL career.
Lifts will be based on the lift table outlined
previously.
The view that new runners to the League
have been allocated over generous
handicaps in their first event.
For the purpose of this decision VAL
Athletes who compete regularly on their
circuit are not considered novice and will be
provided a mark based on their VAL record
at the handicapper’s discretion.
DISQUALIFICATIONS, RED FLAGS AND Z SCORES
These issues were highly emotive across the League. Our approach in making these
decisions was to increase and maintain governance over unacceptable performances by
introducing a human element into the Stewarding equation.
League Decision In response to :
Once handicaps are declared and the race
has been completed there will be NO
disqualification of Athletes on race day
based on their timed run.
Disqualification and other sanctions may
still apply for breaches of the rules
of competition.
The high level of distaste amongst
members for race day disqualification
based on timed runs.
The Leagues exposure to potential litigation
The view (Committee) that an increase in
stewarding will work to prevent the need for
disqualification.
The Chief Steward being still able to apply
other penalties for time- based
underperformance including fines rehandicapping and suspension from future
events.
The use of the term Z score and the
publishing of the flag system will be
removed and will be replaced with the
following:
The Chief Steward will allocate the
following performance ratings to athletes in
all races.
UP – Unacceptable performance. As
determined by the measure of + or –
two standard deviations, in association with
stewards’ observations. (These Athletes will
not be eligible for a lifts until reassessed by
the stewards as AP)
AP – Acceptable performance. As
determined by a measure inside + or -
two standard deviations in association with
steward’s observations. (Eligible
for a lift.)
OA – Ongoing Assessment. Used for
interstate athletes or athletes in
their first three runs in the League
irrespective of their results in Amateur
(Handicapper will assess the initial 3 runs to
determine whether the mark allocated was
appropriate)
The use of the Z score and the red flag
system was regarded as the most negative
aspect of our sport and provided a
significant de-motivator for athletes.
Publishing of Z scores has created rifts
between stables and individuals.
The data will continue to provide stewards
with a good indicator of a potential breach
of the rules.
The standard deviation measure will be
provided to the stewards who will use the
information to address time-based
performance matters directly with an
Athlete.
Performance ratings will be a matter
between the Athletes, the stewards and the
handicapper. Gaming of the current system
has been and is occurring. Stewards will
now be able to assess performance issues
that lie outside of a data-based system.

BAY SHEFFIELD AND CATEGORY 1 AND 2 RACE QUALIFICATION
League Decision In response to:
Athletes in the following races must have
participated in 3 SAAL 120m
races during the previous twelve months
 Bay Sheffield 120m Women and
Men,
 Loxton 120m Women and Men,
 Crystal Brook 120m Women and
Men.
Participants in the Men’s and Women’s
Camden Classic must have
participated in 2 SAAL events during the
current season over 300m, 400m or
550m .
In exceptional circumstances an Athlete
who is of national or international
standard may apply for entry to these
events.
The need for Athletes involved in our
biggest races to be supporters of the SAAL
and its affiliated Leagues.
The reality that Athletes of the highest
calibre are worthy participants in our key
events
JUNIOR ATHLETICS
League Decision In response to;
U18 Athletes will be eligible for all Open
events other than the Bay Sheffield
120m M&W and Camden Classic 400m M&
W where participants will need to be 16
years or over
Junior athletes need to be motivated to run
in League sanctioned junior events as the
number one priority.
U18 age penalties when participating in
open events will still apply however the
formulae will be adjusted to a higher rate
The overwhelming view that Junior athletes
are advantaged by the current formulae.
The need to retain the formula as the basis
for mark setting.
In addition to the above, the League has decided to actively engage with the Victorian
Athletic League to work toward continuity and consistency of handicapping. We will do this
in order to reach agreements such that cross border competitors are not disadvantaged
when they take the decision to compete interstate.
As a committee we expect that the decisions we have made will be accepted by the majority
of members as they are a reflection of matters raised in the report. We want you to know that
the implementation of our decisions will require some system modification and changes to
guidelines which will occur over the next few weeks.
We will work diligently to make this happen in preparation for what is shaping up to be an
exciting motivating and positive season for everyone who participates in our amazing sport.
We thank you for your continual support and are looking forward to seeing you in six weeks’
time.
Yours in Professional Running
Kym Steer on behalf of the SAAL Committee

Interesting reading and good to see the SAAL listening to the masses.
One area of concern is the note saying that to compete in the Bay Sheffield you must have competed in three SAAL events in the previous 12 months. So what you are saying is that virtually no interstaters can compete in the Bay Sheffield this year.
To suggest that Stawell Gift Finalists, Burnie Gift finalists etc can’t compete at the Bay is utterly ridiculous. The VAL have a far superior calendar of events with wind assisted data , proper stewarding and far more accurate data. Reading the above report it is hard to see how many Victorians will be allowed to compete.

CLARIFICATION FOR INTERSTATE RUNNERS

To avoid any doubt to qualify for the Bay Sheffield Athletes must have competed in 3 * 120m Open events  in an affiliated League over the previous 12 months.

So 3 runs in the VAL or other interstate leagues will qualify  Athletes to come over to South Australia and join the Party.

We look forward to having interstate runners back to Colley reserve this year.

Kym Steer
President SAAL

We will update the document to include this clarification. we want to make it easier not harder.

I would expect there will be a few more elements to this outside of the more commonly known past problems.
I'm hearing discussions with the VAL and handicapping is or has taken place to work more closely together.
I'm 100% certain the SAAL wants as many interstaters to come over without being disadvantaged and have a level playing field.

Thanks for the clarification Kym.

May I suggest that if you want to access an easier to read and better laid out version than the one on this post that you go to the SAAL facebook page and follow the link to the original document.

This one includes clarity for interstate Athletes
https://tinyurl.com/mvwa925f

Probably a bit like a budget in politics.
A little bit for the old brigade
A little bit for the new brigade
And a little bit for the interstate brigade.
The budget to please everyone..................nothi8ng wrong with that.
However, I think if you are old enough to drive yourself to the Bay Sheff and good enough to win off the Novice mark or less you should be able to run in the Bay Sheffield.
"Perhaps this needs to be looked into.
U18 Athletes will be eligible for all Open
events other than the Bay Sheffield"
You can either run in Open or you cant.
Doesnt seem right to me that a 17year 6 mth athlete can run in all the open events during the season then cant at the Bay.
Just dont allow them to run off inflated marks.

U18 runners can run in open races all year. This includes 14years old +

You have to be 16 or over to run in the Bay Sheffield and Camden Classic

"U18 Athletes will be eligible for all Open events other than the Bay Sheffield
120m M&W and Camden Classic 400m M&W where participants will need to be 16
years or over

Kym 1958 wrote:U18 runners can run in open races all year. This includes 14years old +

You have to be 16 or over to run in the Bay Sheffield and Camden Classic

"U18 Athletes will be eligible for all Open events other than the Bay Sheffield
120m M&W and Camden Classic 400m M&W where participants will need to be 16
years or over

All good Kym , just read the first two lines

U18 Athletes will be eligible for all Open
events other than the Bay Sheffield

120m M&W and Camden Classic 400m M&
W where participants will need to be 16
years or over

Sorry about the initial lay out, I had trouble adding the file.

No problems it is important that we get this out there.

Kym 1958 wrote:CLARIFICATION FOR INTERSTATE RUNNERS

To avoid any doubt to qualify for the Bay Sheffield Athletes must have competed in 3 * 120m Open events  in an affiliated League over the previous 12 months.

So 3 runs in the VAL or other interstate leagues will qualify  Athletes to come over to South Australia and join the Party.

We look forward to having interstate runners back to Colley reserve this year.

Kym Steer
President SAAL

We will update the document to include this clarification. we want to make it easier not harder.

So just to clarify are 100m open events included as well or only 120m open races?

Hi Kym

Thanks for coming on and being transparent..

Call Stevie dumb.but I read the whole article and was left feeling very confused. So what actually is the new system?

At its most simplest

The system comprises a data base of an Athletes historical performances which provide a weighted average MPS rate that together with the Athletes fastest MPS and a target time for the event will provide the handicapper with data upon which to determine a handicap. Handicappers will determine marks and the system provides intel.

This handicapper and allocated handicaps will be subject to the various rules of the league in terms of novice marks, lifts ( a lift table)  and penalties. Penalties will not be given  when an athlete hasn't placed and received money in a race.

If you want call me tomorrow. 0417838796  We are now in the process of editing handicapping guidelines. The document outlined the big picture decisions which have systemic implications.

Speedy the intent is that Athletes will need to run three 120m races

Kym 1958 wrote:Speedy the intent is that Athletes will need to run three 120m races

I would suggest that 100m events are included.
Someone new to the sport or re registering has 7 events before the Bay, Flinders is a 200m , Port is a 100m and theres 1 country meeting.So if you work and cant make the trip to the Mount, that leaves 4 meetings only to run your 3.
If you have covid, illness of other sorts, family gatherings theres a good chance you may not get your 3 runs in before the Bay.Would hate to think an athlete is being pressured to run with an injury.
Maybe this needs to be looked at or athletes have a right of appeal.
Pretty hard done by if you run the Mort Daly 120m, Brighton 120m , Flinders 200m and Port 100m , plus the 70m events on the card and cant run the Bay Sheff.
Yet someone who only runs Mort Daly ,Brighton and Marion 120m events can.

Thanks Speedy I will take it back to the team we are not about making it impossible.  The devil is in the detail which we are working through now. You are right that it only applies to people new to the sport as its the last twelve (12) months. Goal of course is to get people who want to compete in our showcase meeting to show capacity to the handicapper and their support for the sport in the event in which they are to be handicapped.

Finally back to a handicapping system where coaches need to improve athletes rather than be gifted success.

One last post before I have my account deleted. I thought it appropriate to make on this topic "something to cheer about" because I am sure whoever Sherlock is along with a few others that read this forum will be cheering my departure.

Seems Sherlock is the only one that likes to oppose every single comment I have made along with criticising others for using pseudonyms which is the very thing Sherlock has done. Who knows, who cares! Move on dude! Have a lie down and take a Bex.

If not Colin, be brave and say who you are when you are having a go at someone that never hid from who they are. I'll bet a carton of Becks tinnies you wont.

We cant be liked by all. I get if some dont like me for what I have said, so be it. It was IMO for the right reasons, the best interest, outcomes and passion for the sport and comp. Sure most cases you would be able to speak to those in charge but if you get ignored, yelled at and abused for having a different opinion then you need to go a different angle. I only ever said what I was told or thought to be true, and for those that felt aggrieved. If I have upset anyone then I am sorry.

So anyway, the SAAL is in great hands and is on the up. Thats all I and anyone will have ever wanted. I'm not going to provide a running commentary from here on, so what ever anyone thinks and says on here, whatever.

Thanks to those here and others that read the forum and made a difference in June. I hope the seasons ahead are as you expect or better. Special thanks to SA Whisperer and Z-Score. Thanks to forum Admin for the ability to have our opinions, criticisms good or bad.

Cheers and see ya,
Top Sport aka Shane Grimwade

I have a feeling that the handicappers are about to be announced.
At a function last weekend , I was told, anytime after the Clock strikes midnight for day light saving.
Look for a press release anytime after then.

Right you are SA Whisperer. The SAAL released the following earlier today.

SAAL Facebook Page 30th September 2022.

We are excited to announce the following handicappers for Season 2022/23.
Whilst we have a temporary arrangement in place, we are still urgently seeking an additional 1 or 2 permanent people to handicap the Under 18 Boys and Under 18 Girls.  Please contact Kym Steer as soon as possible to discuss the role 0417 838 796.

Men’s Sprints - Damien Tohl 70m – 550m
Women’s Sprints - Paul Young 70m – 550m
O35 Chris Dimitrak - All distances
Men’s and Women’s Distance Paul Sutcliffe 800m – 3200m
Under 14 Paul Young - All distances

To all those who put up their hands to help thank you!

A reminder to get your nominations in for the following meets:
Marion - CLOSING MONDAY
Burnside - Closing 10th October
Flinders - Now Open
Port - Now Open

http://www.saal.org.au/index.php?id=12

Got the dingalingring from Gossips last night.
One week out from the first meeting and still no Chief.
Gossips has told me that the person who wants the gig , they dont want, and the person that they want to have the gig is saying NO.
Im sure they will come up with the right selection in this coming week.
Strength and respect for the officials in the league begins at the CS .

SA Whisperer wrote:
Gossips has told me that the person who wants the gig , they dont want, and the person that they want to have the gig is saying NO.
.

Heard the exact thing at training Tues night.
Could be another Steven Bradbury occasion.